Less Voodoo Please

[DirtyDave]

It seems to me (just one man's opinion), that the more you know about what's going on in your roaster, the better off you are.
If consistency is important to you (and your customers), some form of automated control is required.
The "roastmaster" who is honest with himself knows how difficult it is to obtain consistent results roasting by feel (even with logging software).
In the SF Bay Area we have a plethora of new light roasting artisan operations, some more experienced than others.
They all are passionate about what they do.
Not a single one knows what temperatures their beans are being subjected to during the roast process (drum skin temperature).
The actual bean temperature is also a relative unknown (sampled only at the front of the drum, and truly measured as the bean/air soup).
The air roasters here are even more casual; passively roasting (and even blending in the roaster) and using way too much water spray.
I think it's time to step it up (yeah, it's more expensive) and take advantage of modern control for the benefit of both roaster and consumer.

 

[ElPugDiablo]

Not a single one knows what temperatures their beans are being subjected to during the roast process (drum skin temperature).
The actual bean temperature is also a relative unknown (sampled only at the front of the drum, and truly measured as the bean/air soup).

If I know the ambiance temperature inside the drum and the bean's surface temperature or as you said the bean/air soup temperature, at any giving time, and control these against established profile, is it necessary to know the drum skim temperature and the actual bean temperature?

I often wonder why coffee roasting and coffee making demand such a degree of quantitative analness? Do bakers PID their oven and stick a thermocouple into the bread and data log while baking? I don't know, maybe they do. If we were to ask Joel Robuchon if he knows the precise surface temperature of the saute pan and the exact temperature of the veal chop at any given time during the entire cooking process, I bet you we'd get a dope slap.

 

[Fred44]

I actually cook that way. Was barbequing chicken on the grill tonight, I had a thermocouple stuck in the middle of the breast waiting for it to hit 160. Takes the guesswork out, and I'm lazy. I could just sit and listen for the alarm. It did come out perfect.

 

[ElPugDiablo]

I actually cook that way. Was barbequing chicken on the grill tonight, I had a thermocouple stuck in the middle of the breast waiting for it to hit 160. Takes the guesswork out, and I'm lazy. I could just sit and listen for the alarm. It did come out perfect.

My guess is you do not know the gas pressure, or how many pieces of charcoal you used, or air temperature inside the grill, or the surface temperature of the grill, or the temperature of the metal skewer. You were able to make perfect chicken by controlling variable that is important to you without having to know other variables. This is exactly my point.

If a coffee roaster were to roast chicken with consistency, he would need chicken weighting the same. He would measure the moisture content of the chicken; he would know the exact air temperature inside the grill; the exact flame setting; the air circulation as measured by CFM inside the grill; he would data log the thermocouple output every 30 seconds (continuous if he is automated); he would duplicate the rise in temperature to a set profile; he would need to reach to "160 degrees" perfection at the exact time, every time; he would then weight the roasted chicken's to know the exact weight loss, and analyze the darkness of the skin. And his chicken is probably no better than yours.

 

[wmark]

Coffee roasting reminds me alot of plastics processing in that it is a "black art". People can be secretive and/or tell you crap. The funniest (depending on your view point) was that the supplier would sell everyone the same stuff and tell them it was customized for their machine (plastics extruder) but charge prices all over the board. Everyone was so secretive that it took a decade (major industry consolidation) before people realized they had been had.

 

[DirtyDave]

I'm beguiled by the resistance to quantification in the coffee roasting industry.
When I started in the metal fabrication trade, some journeyman tinknockers would work with their back to everyone, jealously guarding their "secrets".
Does CAD degrade the modern metal product? Is the hand layout bifurcated pipe a better product than the unfolded CAD generated one? (Quite the opposite.)
Would it be an affront to know why your beans always have that "nutty" (read carbonized) flavor.
How about going back to hand crank starting our cars.
Wait for my next post via USPS.