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  1. #1
    BIC
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    Organic coffee beans : is this truly good for the consumers and the farmers?

    for most of consumers, they really believe that Organic coffee beans are something good. something worth paying extra money for?

    many believes that buying Organic beans thru Fair Trade is something that we (consumers) can help the coffee farmers in 3rd world countries.

    Does Organic coffee really helps our health and the farmer's economic situation?

    there are so many ethical & moral questions relates to Organic coffee. what is your own take on this subject?

  2. #2
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    Years ago we operated a mobile espresso based setup and I worked closely with the roaster we used for all coffees. Guy is a great roaster and goes to various farms throughout the year. I asked him about certified organic (as some customers of ours asked) and he said all the coffees he sourced weren't certified, but easily 96% organic. He also said most farmers can't afford to be certified organic as the payoff usually never matches what's involved in the process. Another thing, he said there was absolutely no difference in taste or quality when comparing 'organic' vs. non-certified. That was all I needed to hear.

    For my green coffee(s) I only buy from Sweet Maria's as based on all I've read they're very involved with making sure farmers get a fair cut of what's involved.
    I'm a legend among my own kind... you my friend are just a legend in your own mind. Later!

  3. #3
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    I don't think most consumers even know what "organic" means. So if you tell them that means only human and animal manure was used to grow those, I guarantee 99% of them will turn away. Just imagine this: Organic Coffee from Human and Animal Manure Only...

    Now "organic" is just about to be replaced by "bio-friendly".

  4. #4
    BIC
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadow745 View Post
    He also said most farmers can't afford to be certified organic as the payoff usually never matches what's involved in the process.
    yes. absolutely correct.
    currently, in Guatemala, Organic farms are "forced" into being organic farms by foreign exporters who demand them to turn into organic.
    being organic farm means 3 years of cultivating their lands with organic fertilizers without getting paid for 3 years. after that, they can be certified as organic farms.
    but their production / yield will be 25 to 30% less than normal. but what they receive in return for organic beans are much less than their loss from low yield and other expenses.

  5. #5
    BIC
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    Quote Originally Posted by WhyCoffee View Post
    I don't think most consumers even know what "organic" means..
    I think that most consumers believe that Organic means better health. they really need to get educated about organic produces ....etc

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIC View Post
    I think that most consumers believe that Organic means better health. they really need to get educated about organic produces ....etc
    Well, it does in some respects... I understand the challenges for organic producers and trust me, to become an organically certified roasting facility it's equally challenging. However, I think as a society we are wise to reduce the number of chemical-based nutrients/herbicides/pesticides out of our food cycle.

  7. #7
    BIC
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    Quote Originally Posted by shadow745 View Post
    he said there was absolutely no difference in taste or quality when comparing 'organic' vs. non-certified. That was all I needed to hear.
    Normally Organic certificates are given to coffee coops that are working with hundreds of small farms (small farms means they produce like 50 bags to 70 bags annually). and it is the coops responsibility to check and maintain each farm as organic.
    however, when the coop has 1000 organic bag certificate for exportation (they can export organic beans up to 1000 bags per year) and some years, they only get 700 bags of organic from farmers. then, they can just ship 300 bags of none-organic beans with "fake" organic certificate.
    it is unwritten law, but almost everyone in coffee origin country knows about this.... but not the consumers in coffee consuming 1st world countries.

  8. #8
    BIC
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musicphan View Post
    Well, it does in some respects... I understand the challenges for organic producers and trust me, to become an organically certified roasting facility it's equally challenging. However, I think as a society we are wise to reduce the number of chemical-based nutrients/herbicides/pesticides out of our food cycle.
    the main problem is that as I posted before, no one really knows which are real organic and which are not.
    there is no taste difference, can not be proven scientifically, can not see the roasting difference...etc

    so, like Clint Eastwood said : "you are shit out of luck!". ha ha ha

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by BIC View Post
    the main problem is that as I posted before, no one really knows which are real organic and which are not.
    there is no taste difference, can not be proven scientifically, can not see the roasting difference...etc

    so, like Clint Eastwood said : "you are shit out of luck!". ha ha ha
    Oh I completely agree with the challenges you speak of... I like the goals of organic certification but execution at origin certainly has its issues.

  10. #10
    BIC
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    Quote Originally Posted by Musicphan View Post
    Oh I completely agree with the challenges you speak of... I like the goals of organic certification but execution at origin certainly has its issues.
    yes. well said.
    as you know, everything comes from Origin. when there are execution problems from origin side and when it is so apparent, the original noble goals of organic become joke and it just becomes a method of marketing for making extra profit for people involved (not the origin side, but importers, distributors and retails)

 

 
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