Separate grinder or built in

[tomc4all]

I am looking for a first espresso (regular, cortado, etc.) machine and maybe one that can even make coffee. The all in one machines from Breville, Philips, and most others, have a built in grinder. From what I read, overall, a separate grinder is better. Well, are there some machines that actually do use a significantly better internal grinder such that if that going all in one is what I want, I am not sacrificing much? I thought some of the Philips machines might be OK, or others, but I do have a good grinder if it really is much better. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Aldis1ne]

If you want simplicity and fewer pieces of gear:
There are all in one espresso machines (like some from Breville, De’Longhi, and Philips) with built-in grinders that are good enough for regular espresso, cortados, and even brewed coffee. Their grinders are usually fine-grind capable and decent quality, so you’re not sacrificing a ton compared to separate gear especially for a first machine.
If you already own a good grinder:
You will get better consistency and control using your grinder with a machine that doesn’t have a built in grinder. Separate grinders generally outperform internal ones, especially for espresso quality.

 

[froze]

In addition to what Aldisline said, whenever you buy something that is two in one type of situation we're discussing you run into a problem with if the grinder or the coffee maker part fails the whole thing gets tossed. So, you spent say $850 for a Breville Barista Pro all in one, now it's in the trash because one of the parts failed. If instead you paid $600 for a Gaggia Classic, and say $250 for a Baratza Virtuoso + coffee grinder for a total of $850, same as the Breville two in one costs. But now if the grinder fails you only have to pay for the grinder again at $250 vs $850 for the a new two in one.

I cheated a bit by using the Gaggia Classic, for the price this a very good espresso maker, it the best electric one under $1,500. It is made of near commercial grade components instead of consumer grade, so instead of lasting 2 to 8 years it will last 10 to 15 years, but there's another huge plus with this machine that other consumer models cannot do...you can rebuild almost the entire thing at home, anything that breaks can be replaced by you. There are also a ton of hacks on You Tube so you change it to fit your needs.

Personally, I like manual coffee makers and grinders because in today's modern world not much will last a long time anymore, what use to last 30 years now will last 12. So, I use nothing but manual coffee makers and grinders, even my espresso maker is a manual pull lever Cafelat Robot, and my grinder is a Timemore Chestnut C3 ESP Pro (this grinder was selected because it can do Turkish powder fine grind all the way to Cold Brew course grind.