Looking for advice from seasoned roasters

[chingo4]

Hello fellow roasters!

My husband and I are located in MD and are trying to get our roasting operation off the ground. We have hit about every single bump in the road imaginable and are simply looking for some words of wisdom from anyone who has been here before. Even if your set-up was the easiest process possible, we'd still love to hear anything anyone has to offer! We are struggling with understanding exactly what the state is requiring from us, which we understand is different depending on the state, but don't know if the state offices we have spoken to even understand exactly what our planned operation is.

Our main concern is that we currently have a commercial space to conduct the roasting, but in order to get it up to code we are going to have to contract out a lot of work before we can get started. When we research other coffee roasters across the country, we notice a trend that many roasters start simply from their garages, but are still able to sell online and distribute to grocery stores/cafes, etc. How is anyone able to start this way and still comply with their state regulations? We can't imagine that every operation is making these dramatic upgrades to their garages in order to meet standard codes. But, perhaps we are naive.

Literally, any information would be a huge help. Thanks!

TLDR: We need help complying with state law, but don't know what is necessary and what isn't.

 

[eldub]

Call your local city gubmit and g et their input. Ask for the person in charge of building code. Ultimately, the fire marshal should be able to clue you in on what he needs to see in each potential roasting location to meet city code as well.

 

[JumpinJakJava]

Did you start with local/municipal/county codes and regulations? That is where I started. These local officials should be able to steer you in the right direction and give you state contacts to continue the journey. It will be a lot of calls and inquiring, red tape road.. Nobody around my area knew what to do with me(local zoning in my small town never had anyone coming before them with a special permit to roast coffee in a residential area). Letters to my neighbors about what I wanted to do(zoning officials recommended this), no problems, thankfully. Converted my garage in to a small roastery. Then there was Health dept., (they too, did not know what to do with me), they recommended smooth surfaces on walls and ceiling. I have no storefront or retailing on my premises. All roasted coffee is either shipped or delivered. Since, I am not a cafe, no fire and safety assembling regs. Then there was the state regs for scales, upon calling they said I did not need to have state inspected and certified scales, because I have no over the counter sales. They did recommend that I did get the scales calibrated, but not required. Then there was construction plans(my wife and I drafted a small plan), that was acceptable at another meeting with zoning.
So, we got the ok finally to start. Like I said a lot of calls, meeting with officials etc.

 

[JumpinJakJava]

Eldub, I must have been typing too slow! Ha! Ha!

 

[slurp]

Most roasters out of their garage are not legit and would fail a state inspection.

Now if your plan on roasting a good amount of beans and having a legit business you will need the following. (in Florida)

hand sink
3 partition sink
state food license or department of agriculture lic.
smooth ceiling above roaster
plan on an afterburner if your roasting a lot if you do not need one then great.
get a good contractor for your build out look for one that specializes in restaurants - yes your going to need plumbing permit at the very least

Make sure which ever roaster you buy is listed on the states approved gas appliances. (right Charlie?)

 

[chast]

You got that right Slurp! Every state and town is different. A women in NM waited 6 months and many changes just because nobody in the town government understood what a roaster is. Nothing more than a stove. If you are going gas then that falls into a whole new area especially with venting. Propane is more costly and the same BS applies in permitting. In my state of Massachusetts the gas appliance must be approved and listed on the MA approved gas appliance web site or the plumbing inspectors will not issue the permit. If I have one table or stool, I need to offer restroom facilities so I have take out only. Most roaster require a Class A pipe and even that can be up to the inspector. Venting can be out the side or straight through the roof. Depending on your building type, wood, steel, rubber roof, will depend on what else is needed. No PVC or PEX pipe can be used in this state for commercial plumbing where as I have seen it approved in Kentucky. All refrigeration should be on its own 20 amp circuit so do the math and make sure your panel is big enough. We require grease traps on the sinks if you are doing any type of cooking. I have my roaster setup in the customer area behind the counters. No customer access. Had a issue with that at first but was resolved quickly. My town also wanted the build out diagram designed by a licensed builder who also had to build the counters. Fought that and won. Did my own. Fl had a issue with one roaster who would not allow a roaster that was built in FL but approved a roaster that was made in Turkey! go figure. Really depends on the ego of the inspector and who you know. Propane cannot be housed indoors but there are hundreds who do. That is a national fire code. I use a quick release 1/2" gas hose which is fine in my town but heard about another roaster in my state that the inspector had an issue with. It is totally legal but the inspector was throwing his weight around. We have to apply in the town for a hearing and they send notices to all abutters. If someone has an issue with me setting up a roastery they would have to have been at the meeting to discuss their issues. Once approved it is off to talk to the building and plumbing people to see what they want. Sometimes asking them before hand helps to prevent future issues, basically make them part of the plan. After 3 months I am opening this week with full support of the Fire Dept and Town officials, plumbing inspector is holding a grudge!!

 

[chingo4]

I apologize for the delayed response, I thought I had set this up correctly to send replies to my email, so I honestly thought no one had responded!

So, thank you for your reply. We have spoken to about every official city and state level that we can think of and every one gives us an almost completely different list of requirements. I do not believe we have tried the fire marshal directly, but I will call today. Thanks!

 

[chingo4]

We started at the county level, who then pushed us to the state, who then pushed us back down to the county, who INSIST we have to go through the state. We can't seem to get a straight answer from anyone and don't want to just shell out a bunch of cash making a lot of renovations that don't end up being necessary. Did you do all of the updating yourself or have it contracted?

 

[chingo4]

This list seems pretty consistent from a few things we have heard at the various levels. Have you heard of having the walls and ceiling be able to be sprayed down with water? That was told to us by one office, that basically we would have to have a Dexter kill room for roasting coffee...what? (Plus a sloped floor with drain.) All of these renovations would cost us more money than we think it might the worth with our current real estate. We are fighting with whether we should just start over at a new location that may already have some of the requirements already in place.

 

[chingo4]

Wow, congrats! But it sounds like it was quite the process. I may have more direct questions in the future as our venture goes on, if you don't mind. But thank you for the insight and providing info on many details we hadn't even approached yet.

 

[JumpinJakJava]

No PVC or PEX pipe can be used in this state for commercial plumbing!

Now that to me is ridiculous! No wonder the price of scrap metal maintains it's value.

 

[chast]

Unions created that rule to keep the costs up and that quote came directly from my plumber. I used CPVC for the drain on my ice machine with some poly tubing in between. Have not been told to remove it as of today, but next week could change

 

[chast]

what state are you in? If you are going to open a certified kitchen along with roastery and cafe then you will have many opinions. A good plumber knows the commercial code as the same with an electrician. They can pretty much set you straight. My plumber was really busy and I opted to use another local company and everything that I wanted to do and knew I could do it that way, this new plumber kept yelling illegal cannot be done. My original plumber came shortly after and did the install as I wanted it, roaster on casters with a quick disconnect flexible hose. Inspection was approved for both. Try to find contracts through friends and make sure they really know the commercial code

 

[HillofBeans]

I know people who started with the health department to find out if where allowed to proceed.Then it just cost like $125. to go wholesale with the county's OK. In NJ the state has to permit only if you want to retail. When you look for permission from the township in an iffy zoned area. They make you pay for traffic studies and floor plans and such. As far as getting a place to code for just roasting, in jersey they just require a three bin sink, water test and exhaust as per manufacturer for the roaster. If you don't really care about location I would just search out a place that needs the least work

 

[HillofBeans]

Most roasters out of their garage are not legit and would fail a state inspection.

Now if your plan on roasting a good amount of beans and having a legit business you will need the following. (in Florida)

hand sink
3 partition sink
state food license or department of agriculture lic.
smooth ceiling above roaster
plan on an afterburner if your roasting a lot if you do not need one then great.
get a good contractor for your build out look for one that specializes in restaurants - yes your going to need plumbing permit at the very least

Make sure which ever roaster you buy is listed on the states approved gas appliances. (right Charlie?)

I really think its up to the state and county. My business is in NJ and I know of people in Pennsylvania with similar but different regulations, who spent a couple of years in their garages totally legit for wholesale and farmers markets. I am just saying go right to the source, the Health departments. Mine where very helpful and even allowed me to do business immediately after the paper work was filed even though it would take over a year for them to inspect me .