POLL: WHAT'S WRONG WITH STARBUCKS?

[javayankee]

I appreciate your comments unit_number_43...it's clear you know the Starbucks menu well. And it's true...that caramel drink really should be called a Vanilla Latte, Affogato style with caramel drizzle...granted, that's a mouthful and another name would be much easier to market. But I think it really *is* a misnomaer to call it a caramel machiatto...and not really being anal. Truth is, Starbucks has a very large megaphone at its disposal and what they do affects trends. So when a large company like this starts to blur the lines of what is already something rather esoteric for most americans (espresso drinks) it is actually kind of damaging to education of the public at large. Another example is of this is the "espresso roast". Most people feel espresso is a type of roast for a bean, when of course the truth is espresso is a drink, not a roast level. With the power Starbucks has also comes responsibility. Don't get me wrong though...I have plenty of positive things to say about them as well, but this is one of my bigger beefs.

what you're describing is an espresso machiatto. traditionally a shot with just alittle bit of milk on top. the carmel machiatto however is a full drink. if you wanted to call it a latte it would be a Vanilla Latte, Affigato style, with caramel drizzle. saying that a caramel machiatto is a misnomer is just being anal. Next you're going to say that the Frappacino doesn't actually come with a pair of nice slacks. Maybe the name was butchered, but it's now very obvious as to what yo'ure getting.

It does bother me that the "caramel" drinks don't usually have any caramel in them. Caramel Apple Cider for instance only has caramel on top, not actually in the drink.

 

[unit_number_43]

Point well taken JavaYankee. You're absolutely correct. I actually work at a starbucks. I think there is this idea that Starbucks is like McRandom_company in that the employees know nothing about the products they sell and are trained only in running the register. Starbucks actually goes well out of its way to insure that everyone that works there has a complete understanding of coffee from birth to brew. And it's actually required that we taste and document every coffee we sell, and recently a tea program was also started.


CafeNomad;
The stock option alone is really impressive. An employee sections out a precentage of their check each pay period. At the end of the quarter they find the lowest point the stock was over the entire quarter, then subtract 15% and that is what you buy the stock at.

 

[tweaked]

Re: Char...er, Strabucks

Hello everyone, i'm new here,anybody heard of Second Cup?
Or are they only in Canada?
Starbucks has really bad tasting coffee,i have purchased many cups
and many#of beans,Second cup is so supperior to Starbucks!
am i missing something?

going through this thread i came across numerous comments, or compliments, made about Second Cup. thank you, i work with the Second Cup, don't worry, i'm not working in any of the department focused on profit bottom line. what I can tell you is that the Second Cup is actually a "specialty coffee bean" retailer, who sells brewed coffee items and complimenting food products as an opportunity market. and, because Second Cup is a coffee retailer, that is why you'll usually find that our coffee does taste much more yummier then others.

Second Cup is a francise with nearly 400 cafes across Canada. selecting franchisee to operate these cafes is a challenge. you may be surprised how difficult it is to find potential franchiees that are well rounded.

oopps, my dogs giving me the PUPPY eyes, he's wanting to go outside.

i'm planning on dropping by this forum frequently.

thank you for welcoming me.


hey no loss of checking out my employer's site to learn more.

www.secondcup.com

 

[topher]

omg...tell me tweaked didn't say yummier! welcome tweaked...this forum kicks butt...just try and not use it as a place to sell your company...everyone on here has the best coffee in world...so we try and not push our product and just keep it to coffee..not sales....anyhoo...welcome :wink: omg...did I just say anyhoo...need coffee now

 

[Rockcreekcoffee]

Starbucks

Starbucks!!...mmmh. I agree with many of the comments on this forum. My shop is not open on Sundays (due to it being in a downtown area). So, if I am craving a iced latte - I will go to SBucks. I don't do it very often, but you can pick up alot of information from their stores.

They pay people "Big Bucks" to do their marketing research, drink menus etc...if I can "Borrow" an idea - tweak it to make it my own, then poof - I have a new marketing tool or drink.

I don't frequent the other local chain in my area. Depending on which store I go to, it depends on what I'll get - no consistancy. At least at SBucks I know what I'll be getting.

Just keep in mind, who would have thought McD's would have ever posted a loss in their revenue 10 or 15 years ago, when they were growing & marketing like gang busters.

Starbucks - like McD's has the consistancy (good or bad) in their product. That's how they have been able to survive and have such growth. That within itself - should be the first thing independents do.

Thanks for letting spout my 2 cents.

rockcreekcoffee

 

[equus007]

Starbucks Stuff

One of the things that I have always loved about Starbucks is that it forces the independants to do more. In Austin we are glutted with coffee houses and the Starbucks here have more or less turned to the "get em in and get em out shops" leaving it to the mom and pops to provide the "come on in and hang out". From my experience they do not try to compete with them on this issue and it has led to the non chain/franchise shops developing creative luch menus, special events calendars and the like. They do ofcourse try to drive out most of the other chains(which I have always found funny because most of the other chains here are in fact owned by A&G...Starbucks parent company) but know that our city will only tolerate so much "big business" coffee.
While I do think their drip is nasty swill and I certainly don't apprectiate the whole mini-caramel latte called a macciato(sorry bout the spelling...raised on spell check) problem this is to be expected. One should not go to any chain and expect to get the best latte or cup of joe in the world. They will however be consistant and for many people that's exactly what they want first thing in the morning.
Also from a plantation stand point Starbucks cerification standards are very good for the industry. They expect alot from the growers they buy from and expect a higher level of consideration for the workers than fair trade does and do not discriminate against large growers as fair trade does...even if they are just going to burn the crap out the beans they your people took so long to make distinctive.

 

[love8me]

except the prize.....

 

[fabraden]

Starbucks has done a lot to initially improve quality standards in general over the years, but now since they are the King of the giant coffee castle their core foundation is crumbling! I don't mind paying money for a decent cup, so long as I get what is promised in an inviting environment (Third Place). Here are my issues: 1. When I order a coffee to have in, I get a paper cup! 2. My drinks (most notable lattes) have never been consistent! 3. The bars in-which I have been getting my drinks range from disgusting to OK. 4. The stores are designed to get people in/out as fast as possible! 5. The drive through's have put Starbucks in the league of the Fast Food Companies. The brand has been devalued for the sake of speed and convenience, no more third place, and in my opinion the cost of a drink at a drive through becomes a rip off!! So, initially Starbucks increased awareness and upped the quality in an incredible way, but now are in the process of lowering consumer expectations to gain maximum profit - dirty stores, paper cups, inconsistent performance, tea in a bag in a paper cup .... and people still queue like ants drawn to honey! Oh and by the way, bring back the 8oz cup - the best part of a any drink is the first 8 oz - the rest is just a waste!

Francis Braden

 

[caffe biscotto]

I agree Francis. It's why I prefer indie coffee shops.

Once a friend of mine saw some yuppie guys passing by with their Starbucks coffees in hand and he said "bunch of coffee snobs". I corrected him by asking "if they were eating Big Macs, would you call them burger snobs?", LOL. I reminded him that real "coffee snobs" wouldn't be drinking Starbucks...

So, if you don't like Starbucks, then don't go there. :wink:

 

[PinkRose]

Hello Francis,

Welcome to the coffeee forums!

In your recent posting to this topic area you said, "So, initially Starbucks increased awareness and upped the quality in an incredible way, but now are in the process of lowering consumer expectations to gain maximum profit - dirty stores, paper cups, inconsistent performance, tea in a bag in a paper cup .... and people still queue like ants drawn to honey! ".

It goes to show that Starbucks has helped the independent coffee shops by initially increasing the public's coffee awareness. Because of Starbucks, a large percentage of the public is hooked on coffee that's not from a vacuum packed can. Now that Starbucks has obviously lowered their standards (including their coffee quality), the "ants who are drawn to honey" will definitely get a pleasent surprise when they walk through the doors of an independent coffee shop. The friendly atmosphere, the clean environment, the clinking of the real coffee cups, and the freshly brewed (not burnt) coffee are all factors that ideally should bring the folks back time and time again.

The hard part is to get those "ants" to wander over to the independent cafes, because once they do, they'll probably have such a memorable experience that they'll keep on coming back.

I agree with Caffe Biscotto. Now that you've discovered that you don't like Starbucks, look for a local independent coffee shop and give it a try! You'll be glad you did.

Rose

 

[fabraden]

Hello Rose,

I just visit Starbucks these days to remind me how much better the independent coffee companies have become. Toronto has great coffee bars and it is quite an experience visiting stores that have owners who care!

 

[Undergrind Roasters]

Simple Economics

In the beginning, there was Columbia
And for a while, it was good.
Then there came Starbucks,
And bygaw it made sugar taste like salt.
The ways of the monopoly we're being challenged
And for a while, it was good.
Then came the great expansion
And the demand was high, and the executives rejoiced.
But an international product must be standardized:
Seasonality, Individual Farms, Single-Origins were lost;
And we saw the retreat from quality beans
And the embrace of quality flavoring, over-roasting, and advertisement.
Some say it was destiny, pure economics...
Those toiling on the farms of the past knew the day would come
When customers demanded quality
to start at the beginning
and continue
forevermore
sancionados

Keep your bags separate.
Keep your eyes glued to the "Cup of Excellence."
Save the sugar for your honey.

-David

 

[jlyon10]

Excellent reply. Very profound.

 

[PinkRose]

Hello David.

Wow!
I agree. That certainly was an excellent reply. It definitely is "food for thought"...

Rose

 

[thewilliams1]

Thanks David.

I got nothing.